Difference between revisions of "Otto J. Roos Debrief"

|Author=Otto Roos and [[Antony_A_Phillips]]

Otto Roos' contact with Scientology, mainly his contact with L. Ron Hubbard, including his failed attempt to handle Hubbard's case, which included examining an eight foot high stack of case folders. This material, from 1984, was written on typewriters and photocopied. See end for summary of editing process, etc. The material was issued by myself (on paper, photocopied) and the start here is my introductions to issues sent out to my contacts. The beginning was written in 1993, about ten years after I was  thrown out of Scientology (unofficially, i.e. no written SP declare to my knowledge). [[Antony_A_Phillips]]

page there is a comment on [[David Mayo]]'s centre  [AAC], which was at

against the Church.)<ref> [http://www.lermanet.com/scientologynews/david-mayo-scientology-case.htm church of Scientology loses to Mayo]</ref> Now ten years after the present independent

and "What sort of behavior would you expect from a person who had

 

 

 

 

 

::::::::::::::  Ref: '''Our Phone Call last night'''

Others' histories are not included, as it would have become a book.

 

== '''THE O. J. ROOS STORY'''                                     7th Sept. 84  ==

'''Introduction'''

''A History of Man'', now I sat there "Give-me-that-hand'ing"  for

active suppression, and would and ''did'' come back.

I saw this even in the old days, though ARC was then still very

The Tech and its application were fantastic, yet, on Flag many

The quality of "unreasonableness" as an expression of "toughness as

Factual Non Comprehension and Real Situations only got suppressed

Peculiar for "ARC outfits", this inability to grant beingness.

Ultimately we have ''all'' been guilty of this.  Scn did not fall

Staff appeared in poor financial condition, odd for a group making

In later years, after the SHSBC and joining staff, I noticed things were  

By that time I had become senior auditor, also OEC, FEBC and long  

The ship was for years nearly always in low conditions , little to  

"Unreasonableness" was used to get slave labour, 100 hour work

This may sound motivatorish, or like a communist, but it isn't.   

I am all for rewarding upstats, also for helping the less effective

"Never giving the public individual a choice" is one of the most

The real deterioration set in with the advent of severe ethics,

Stress on statistics started then in earnest.  The delivering of

Having myself as a child experienced and survived the atrocities of

I would also have refused the "crows nest" 4 hours on and off

The severe "unreasonability" started in earnest in Sept 1967 when

Things got worse as OT 3 research moved on, often running into

To say that "LRH could not have know about this" can only be

Overboards, so the rumour line goes, as John Atack told me, were

originated by me.  I was indeed the first overboard, in [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melilla Melila] for

Overboards as SOP started on the Class VIII course as an LRH  

As first Flag VIII C/S (Class VIII Case Supervisor) I continued the practice until I read a session of VIII auditor Peggy Moreshead as pc, and discovered what it did do to some.  I stopped the practice right then and there.  (Overboarding meant nothing to me, good swimmer, and I considered the whole procedure of 'being bequeathed to the deep as to arise a better thetan' pure nonsense.  It must have meant something to LRH also, as Quentin, when trainee, was never overboarded but always had his name taken off the list by Diana Hubbard, CS1 (Commodore Staff Aide Division 1).

Overboarding was restored by LRH on the Dianetics Course in 1969.

I was not all innocent and 'Sweetness and Light'.  Far from it.  I

There was continued data about "SMERSH", (from James Bond books),

We had a few experienced sea people, like Ron Pook, John O'Keefe,

Roger Buckeridge, [http://scientolipedia.org/info/Joe_Van_Staden_-_Birth_of_the_Sea_Org,_Pt._1 Joe Van Staden], myself and maybe a few more.

In the old Sea Org days, the minimum requirements were Clear, Class

Later in 1968, after the requirements were lifted, we got hundreds

The ensuing shore flaps were not always "SMERSH'S" doing.

Late '67 and early '68, as the only OT 2, Class VII, I had the tech

A 'wog' pro seaman, like the Chief Engineer of the [http://scientolipedia.org/info/Apollo Royal Scotman],  

However, the conditions came to be accepted by the SO 'make-things-

The billion year contract was signed of our 'free will' (and some

Swedes, who objected, were immediately beached to 'never be

given upper level materials' and declared).

'Beaching' I have seen many times, it did not improve port

The father of a Flag girl (Susan Meister), who committed suicide,

'downstat' 'deserved'.<ref>[http://johanw.home.xs4all.nl/CoS/APieceOfBlueSky/bs4-4.htm the Death of Susan Meister]</ref>

Nobody ever dared say anything about these things and risk losing

Our lives were completely mapped out, 24 hours a day.  Personal

Full grown people were completely being lived.

The day started with the 'Musters', sing songing KSW , followed by  

LRH gave many 'reasons' for the above, which I ended believing in,

As 2nd mate under MSH, the CS2, I had to force crew to study.   

LRH said, 'Class VIII auditors can be made in 3 weeks' and, also,

I can give with names and events many examples, all stating the

Personally I had the toughest this life survival track and mainly

[http://scientolipedia.org/info/Athena Avon River] in Denmark in 1970.

The answer to all the above is the method of 'handling'

Much contact with him, especially in the SO days, mainly on

Early in 1966 I had originated and set up one of the first OT

Most of the records were a shamble, but we got it worked out.

The final amount, so he told me later, he 'forgave' the church.

His tremendous ability to recall details was phenomenal.  His

LRH was an entirely different person when dealing with, talking

This was no 'hidden data line', but such personal lectures gave

OT 2 Project 'Whole Track Recall', myself I/C , briefed by LRH,  

This research had continued in the early SO days when Class VII  

In pure auditing tech, he was just LRH!  In this area he had a

with him on these lines, like [[John McMaster]], [[David Mayo]], myself, and

The mistakes made in upper level research really hurt in mind and

L/N data.'''

He was not the Source of the data, it was always there, he was not

The auditing was not  'easy way' for him and his research

1965 and 1966 further testing and research regarding low TA  

Then came Ellen Carter, terminal cancer case on the CC  

All this under LRH daily supervision/briefing, showing the

During 'Mission into Time'  he was away on the Avon River

and I, on Flag, mocked up the H.O.T.A. Course (Hubbard Operating  

I had wanted Class VII as a prerequisite, but he cancelled that.

He also insisted the Course last 3 weeks.

With the practical, the overboards started.  Some

Mentioning that 'the key-out effect of raised necessity level would

He himself was in horrible shape at the time.  Lectures had a lot

He was upset by student goofs.  I had intended the course to be for

He had a certain idea, that's the way it had to be, regardless!  It

The exact same pattern in the new Dianetics Course

On this course the overboards were reinstated.  The unusual

As Special Cramming Officer I merely carried out exact briefings he

I started to wonder about the number of times he acted in a

'Quickies' were not started by Craig de Fan, Bill Deitsch, and Rod

Later he wanted the additional processes compiled which were then

One night I just got up, bypassed the Messengers, walked into his

I was overboarded the next day by MSH for 'bypassing'.

The triple S and D which I originated and test-ran went the same way.   

Triple Power, which I originated, wrote the commands for, test-ran

Even LRH ordered tech investigations could often not be gotten

I don't believe anybody else ever did that, but in TECH matters I

At times he called me into his office and even his bedroom to talk.

He always thanked me very graciously, 'thank you for listening,

It was, when Flag had become a very busy ship with tons of outside

On discovery of this he suddenly called me up, mocked up the

In my experience he adhered to Stat policy.  Several times, when  

MSH, in these days, was exactly the same.  She ripped up several

The advantage of working directly under LRH/MSH prevented one from

So, I never had problems with 'Seniors', as, except for LRH/MSH, I

[had] no 'boss'.

Despite the dangers of 'making him wrong', LRH was in tech matters

'''[[Quentin Hubbard]]''' received a Class XII although he seldom audited,

Auditing family members was a different matter.  LRH would always

Auditing space was a problem, and some of it was done in the Mini

He could be ferocious.  July 1968 saw a very special

The Mafia part was a cinch.  It made me a lot of enemies in LA,

There were other such like things.  Off the 'beaten track', often

He himself, gathering from his tales about him and his brother,

Yet, sometimes I thought he saw 'Martians'.  For example on

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madeira Madeira], he showed several people the mountain where a famous whole

In [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corfu Corfu] he once indicated to me, what he said was an entire fleet

He showed locations of significance in Las Palmas, of importance in

He did many of above type things, relating to upper levels.

He was very validative to individuals who gave him lots of credit,

Originators of HCOB's, Technical Policies had to always credit him,

For example, there is an old Flag Order defining the Condition

Regarding the S and D, Flag auditors were held responsible if Org

Hence the development of other flow S and D's and Student Assists.

This was quite different from later compilation work by Tech Data

John McMaster had been in the same position during the development

Neither his name or mine still appear on the relevant HCOB's since

It was quite a dubious state to be 'SP', after having occupied the

But then, I'm sure, Nibs Hubbard, Dr. Joe Winter, The Halperns,

It appears to invalidate the tech (was it entirely compiled and

It wasn't the tech, it was something which happened to all of those

The tech only enhanced.  It will have done the same to the other

The weakness in LRH was not that he too made mistakes but was the

''His'' mistakes were always 'another' publishing something over his

To just send it back, even implying the mistake could possibly have

This did not change.  Even the very recent HCOB about F/N's of

C/S instructions in his own handwriting, sometimes resulting in an

'Quickies', the Jenny Edmonds Clearing Course Programme, the

And why?  All he would have had to say - and he also did do that

It was this mistake which terminated him in the end and nearly scn

 

When LRH was very sick in Jan 1972 he sent a note to Jim Dincalci,

Jim called me for help.

I wrote to LRH, asking his approval that 'as he now had the

He sent back an approval (plus a 7 page handwritten Commendation,

My function was C/S, either Tommy Klingvall, Brian Livingston, or

Folders came in from all over the world, going back to 1948.  Most

It became a stack of some 8 feet high, an entire filing cabinet

The aligning and FESing, even in the hands of the XII's, took

He had, with the Commendation, also sent a note down regarding the

This was done during the next few months, the sessions sent up to

He, while the FESing and programming cycles occurred was on MO

In the folders we found virtually every process known as well as

This was the tech of those times, the auditors, I'm sure, did the

Rehab data, the Laws of L/N  etc., were unknown at the time of these  

sessions, and were never applied to ''him''. F/N data the same.

As a matter of fact, this was the reason for my setting up this

There were lots of, what was later labelled, 'discreditable' reads.

This was what R2-12 and Tiger Drilling had been all about and it

There were in the Research and Solo folders also lots of personal

The recent research folders, OT 3 on up, were, though in order of

The folders were divided over the different auditors with cross

The section which is called OT 8 today had been part of much

The same barriers, NOTS and OT 8, looking at it now, also

The thing which needs stressing here is that as C/S or FESer one is

There is also the rule that no pc gets to see his own folders.

He had an attack in March/April, was in MO care and some weeks

One day, when all the XII's were on leave, except myself, he sent a

They were just taken, and that was that.

A few days later I was called up to his office and upon entry was

He just blew his stack on finding the references to 'discreditable'

He shouted that he had never had such reads and  

She said with a straight face, 'No Sir, you never had such reads.'

There is another kind of read which, in writing them down, closely

This is not what several XII's, including I, with good eyes had

He then screamed that I and the other XII's had 'of course talked

Completely maniacal reactions, especially toward the best and most

However, also typical Missed Withhold Reactions, mere pc

He had also looked at tons of out lists, wrong items, unhandled

This pc had certainly never been handled.  His altitude, apart from

An auditor he had selected once certainly never did.  She caved in

There were in the solo folders a lot of things personal to him.

He was very angry and I confronted him, after which he said, 'What

The other XII's had not been around so I caught the brunt of all of

What I really minded was MSH's denying of having seen and written

Later that evening MSH came down to my cabin.  She kept coming in

My answer was that this might all be true but that I, as C/S, could

As Diana Hubbard also came to shout at me 'I hate you', 'I hate

David Mayo, Class X trainee at the time, and not involved in the

LRH somehow refused the truth of the folders, and my stubbornness

'Station Termination', my days were numbered.

It was interesting to see how many people suddenly 'discovered'

A slight goof by Quentin (then C/S) and myself a few days later

However, knowing what was in the folders, I did not give up the

even knowing where it was, I spotted Flag's location in [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porto Oporto] and on the

But there still was an 8 feet stack of folders which needed handling!!!

I left Portugal with $100 in my pocket, subsequently did well in

In fact, I lost nothing, as neither NOTS, nor OT 8 contained any

When David Mayo came to salvage LRH years later... David never saw

Yes I know what is in all of these folders and what he lived and

It sure wasn't that David couldn't have run the XII programme, as

One ought to realize the potential power of only one wrongly

Virtually anybody close to LRH on tech lines who left (John

From data recently gathered in SHUK, Clearwater, the AAC , in  

Since leaving Flag I paid off a (mainly false) F/L (Free Loader's

This was suddenly stopped and I was taken to an RTC, an unknown  

As the Services were subsequently not delivered, despite repeated

Quite a waste of 2 weeks Affluence income!

The above pages do not cover all my interrelations with LRH, the

The positive gain experienced from knowing and working with LRH is

To the best of my recollection:

1947 (J. Atack's track table) LRH publishes 'Scn a new science'.

1.) Late 50's, my entry in DN, then SCN.

2.) Mid 1965 arrival at SHUK.  SHSBC in 10-11 weeks.

3.) August 1965 Class VI.

4.) Invited by MSH, on grounds of SHSBC record, to do Class VII.

5.) Holidays for a month.

6.) Class VII trainee.  Discovered a 'new world', the 'green on

PrPr's  and Power Plus would be bought and paid for (75 hours).   

A reading SP question would mean having to do an S&D, another 5

Pc's would have wait in Qual, sometimes for months for full

In the mean time they could not study and their money would run

This is where Listing and Nulling got its bad name.  A very simple  

SHSBC students in these days also had to find their own pc's for

After mastering the Policy (on the Organization Executive Course,

Later, as OESSH), mentioning this to LRH he answered that we  

These are some of the things as to the truth of the era when LRH

There were for the Class VII's also lots of LRH PrPr briefings and

7) Dec 1965 Graduation Class VII

8) Further PrPr research, also E/W's, the Clearing Course (CC),  

9) Appointment as SH Class VII Case Officer Review, then senior

The first clears after John McMaster coming off the lines.  The

Also the arrival of not just the SP TECH (early motivator flow

The tone of these declares was most enturbulative, fear really

I saw one girl who is now a famous Class XII auditor cave in

Great points, early Clears.  One did not just attest, one was

I received [?reviewed] quite a few of the early ones and the experience of

Ron Pook reviewed me and I became Clear 25 on the 'John Mc Pope of

Scientology' day, where he [?John McMaster] was validated by LRH, and I shared the joy  

10) March 1966 OEC grad.

11) Aug 1966 Clear 25

12) Aug 1966 OT 2 Research Mission 'Treasure' as I/C and auditor,

After this a lot of Upper Level data, Tony Dunleavy and John

13) Aug 1966 appointed OESSH by MSH. Stats which had never exceeded

During this year, 7 HCO Exec Secs came and went, I was OES, Brian  

Quirino Assistant Guardian (AG), [[Ken Urquhart]] was LRH Communicator  

LRH was not in SH most of the time, he was setting up the 'Sea Project'.<ref>[http://scientolipedia.org/info/Joe_Van_Staden_-_Birth_of_the_Sea_Org,_Pt._1 Sea Project]</ref>

14) About Feb 1967, affluence and (of course) the comm-evs, on me

15) Aug 1967, highest ever stat, comm-ev.  The very moment the

(As my OT 2 declare had been stopped by committee, he  

He then called me [to] Las Palmas.

16) Forgotten, Spring 1966, the LRH Finance Committee (see page 7,

17) I had to leave the SO Project to find a ship.  Mission orders,

As [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiang_Kai-shek Tjang Kai Check](sp) was forming a fleet to invade the mainland, the

locating the [http://scientolipedia.org/info/Apollo Royal Scotsman] in Scotland.  Looking it over, papers sent

A brief stop off, after the mission had been completed, with a

18) Pre coming to Flag (now the Royal Scotman), as the only OT 2,

19) Dec 1967, first AO started in Valencia, Hank Laarhuis OES,

20) Upon arrival in Valencia LRH called me personally off the ship

21) First action was to send John McMaster around the world for

22) Jan 1968 I made several tours to SHUK to give talks and recruit

23) A buzz of early declares, Chris Weideman as first OT 3, myself  

24) The stats went from about 30, to 50, to over the 100 mark and

The next day I grabbed by ethics 'file', a whole drawer full, all

LRH came to Flag, tore into the Committee, and I had a few more

'Just finding LRH' in the middle of the night was not a surprise

There had been a lot of research on ''OT Abilities'', started back in 1966

Apparently I must have used the same 'tech' to find the Apollo,

Interesting trials, these things, and he wanted them published.

Based on the same principles he appointed Quentin and me 'skull

LRH himself was a lot into this stuff.  Once, when I was OOD

On the other hand he also, years later, published something on

25) The early AO days were very exciting, the tech, the pc's, but

The AO went into a hotel, here too, PR and Shore Flaps.

26) Eventually we were sent on the Liability Cruise under Captain

27) July 1968 "Mafia and OT 3 Mission" (page 11, original document)

28) Aug 1968 LRH and crew on the Avon River, "Mission into Time",

29) Expanded drug research, 7 types of resistive cases, OT 3 new

30) Class VIII course, overboards, etc.  (Page 8, orig. doc.)

31.)  October and November appointment as Flag VIII C/S, end of

Lots of FCCI's (paying pcs from the public) aboard, sailing in